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Plato's Rabbit Cave's avatar

I have yet to see any evidence that flat Earthers actually exist.

To qualify as a FE (ie someone who genuinely believes the Earth is flat) one must AT THE VERY LEAST reject the globe Earth model, and that includes rejecting all technologies and infrastructure that are derived from, and rely on, the globe Earth model. That includes google maps (and all conventional maps), international air travel and freight, all communications relying on satellites or undersea cables, GPS and cell phones etc.

I have yet to come across a self identifying FE who has actually given up any of these technologies or infrastructure. None of the 'big names' in FE that are mentioned in this post have. And so they cannot claim to have actually rejected the globe Earth model in their daily lives, and so they cannot claim (in good faith) to be a 'Flat Earther'.

To put it simply, if you claim there are no mountains on Earth you must give up your annual skiing trips to the Swiss Alps. If you claim there are no oceans on Earth you must cancel your 3 week cruise vacation. And if you claim the Earth is flat (or any shape other than the current globe one that our entire modern civilisation is founded on) you must give up all the activities and technologies that rely on globe Earth measurements.

Anyone claiming the Earth is flat who still flies internationally or uses google maps or GPS or owns a cell phone is a fraud. They are no different to someone who claims they communicate via telepathy, but get caught using a cellphone. The only difference is that FE's openly use international air travel, GPS, google maps etc. They don't even try to hide it.

The accepted distances between all the different cities on planet Earth only fit a globe Earth model. If the Earth is not a globe then all those distances are incorrect. The further you travel (such as internationally, or between continents) the more inaccurate those distances must be. Long haul plane flights should fall out the sky due to running out of fuel (or get hopelessly lost, or land 4 hours early with half a tank of fuel left) IF the planet is not a globe and we've got it all wrong. But they don't. The globe Earth model works perfectly. All distances on a globe Earth match our experiences when travelling by land, air or sea.

But when arriving at a conference to speak these self identifying FE's do not claim to have travelled a different distance from their country of origin than the conventionally accepted globe Earth distance. Nor do they claim to have travelled by their own personal transport (ship, horse, dragon whatever). They openly admit to using international air travel and the network of flight routes and navigation which is derived from, and relies on, the standard globe Earth model. This fact alone makes them total frauds right from the get go.

IDENTIFYING as something is not the same as BEING something. If you're going to identify as a 'man' or a 'woman' at least make the effort to behave accordingly, even if you cannot pass. FE's don't even make the most basic effort to conform to their self proclaimed identity. Yet they demand we accept that they really are FE's. I don't accept their identity for a minute. And this is actually the most compassionate thing to do. If they want to be FE's they must give up modern technology and live completely off grid. Or only use airlines and shipping companies who deviate from the standard globe Earth dimensions and distances.

Many self identifying FE's would desist from their FE identity if we made such basic demands of them. And this would be good for them. BY humouring them (giving them extra special treatment at conferences or in podcasts and interviews and accepting their gaslighting) we are actually insulting them.

FE's are literally mocking the very concepts of 'science' and 'scientific theory'. They are mocking language itself. FE is to science what goth makeup is to vampirism. It is the most superficial veneer imaginable. It is pure fashion and identity. Pure narcissism. Of course goths do not (generally) claim to actually BE vampires. They just enjoy the look (which is fine). But FE's do claim to actually believe the Earth is flat. For real. That is what makes them socially divisive and a destructive influence on society.

Demanding everyone else in society recognise and pander to your own contradictory identity and behaviour is the ultimate in anti social behaviour. It is cultural vandalism. FE's are in the same category as any other narcissistic, entitled, disruptive progressive feminist or SJW.

And on top of that they waste everyone's time debating this crap for hours and hours when we could be figuring out practical solutions to actually make the world a better place.

Inviting these clowns to speak at supposedly serious convention, events or podcasts is like inviting a woman with a carrot stuck on her nose who self-identifies as a witch so she can give a lecture on witchcraft. Or to debate the validity of witchcraft with a non believer.

I'm not suggesting FE's should be 'banned', but at least someone should grill them on their ridiculous identity and ask them why they still use globe earth maps, air transport, GPS and other technologies. At least call out their hypocrisy and use them as a valuable teaching aid to show the audience what gaslighting looks like.

A theory is more than an 'identity'.

In order to promote a FE THEORY you must have a theoretical model. The theoretical model needs to be predictive so that it can be compared to nature (objective reality) and be either confirmed as valid (conforms to nature) or falsified as invalid (does not conform to nature).

In the case of FE, this means some kind of a FE map of the world with an actual scale on it. The scale is what turns a 'picture' into a map. That is the bare minimum FE's need to provide us with in order to turn their 'identity' (their 'makeup') into a theory.

Not one single self identifying FE has ever produced such a map. The various pictures of a disc with distorted countries drawn onto it do not qualify as maps because they have no scale. They have no scale for a reason. If you put a scale on it the whole thing falls apart. If the scale fits the known distances between London and Paris or LA to NYC then the distances between Sydney and Johannesburg or Cape Town to London suddenly become 3 times longer than the conventionally accepted distances we all use currently. This means long haul flights should take twice as long to get there, or drop out of the skies after running out of fuel.

Until FE's can produce a workable FE map with distances and a scale on it, they don't even have a theory. All they have is gaslighting.

Injecting this gaslighting into the 'alternative' and 'truther' communities serves to divide them and weaken them, and it also allows the mainstream to dismiss the whole thing as a bunch of clowns with zero intelligence or grip on reality. And to be fair, that is an accurate label to apply to anyone taking FE seriously.

FE grew as an online phenomenon in the run up to the 50th anniversary of the alleged Apollo moon landings. For anyone paying attention at the time it was clearly a psyop to discredit skeptics of Apollo by planting a giant turd into the punchbowl in the form of FE nonsense.

It is commons now for skeptics of Apollo (and now other topics such as virology and germ theory) to be hand waved away as 'crazy flat Earthers'. This makes it easy to shut down any conversation or debate, which stops any legitimate criticism from leaking into the mainstream social discourse. It also serves to deter 'normies' from being critical of these topics, for fear of being labelled 'one of those flat Earthers'.

So, all in all, self identifying FE's are doing a great job propping up the mainstream system they claim to be so keen to dismantle.

https://rumble.com/v3x9jag-what-every-critic-of-flat-earth-theory-gets-wrong..html

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Suzi's avatar

There are some pretty good people taken up with the possibility of the earth being flat, and who knows? Maybe it is flat for them, because we do create our own realities (though to what extent I'm not 100% sure!🙃) Anyway, I'm of the opinion that the earth is a sphere, though my thinking isn't backed up by physics (that's too much for my brain). I like the simple test proposed for seeing the sun set a couple of times! And that the flat earth promotion is an CIA psy-op makes far more sense than a flat earth.

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